3rd Hour Discussion Board #2 - MythBusters Bust the Moon Hoax

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3rd Hour Discussion Board #2 - MythBusters Bust the Moon Hoax

Post  Admin on Mon Aug 30, 2010 10:46 am

Watch the Mythbusters video where they attempt to use science to bust the theory of the moon hoax. Reflect on the video and answer ONE of the following questions. In addition to your posted reflection, respond to the postings of TWO of your classmates.

1. Select a piece of the moon hoax theory that you found to be most convincing. How did the Mythbusters attempt to bust this part of the moon hoax theory? Be sure to identify IV, DV, constants, DETAILED procedure, and the conclusion that they were able to draw from their experiment.

2. Discuss the importance of determining the validity of a source in science. Why is it important for us to do our homework and look at both sides of an issue before taking a stance? Why is it so easy to believe things that we see? What is the danger in not doing research to ensure the validity of a source? After watching both videos, where do you stand in regards to the moon landing? Be sure to support your stance.

Initial Posting: Due Wednesday, September 1 at 11:59 pm
Response Postings: Due Friday, September 3 at 11:59 pm

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Busting The Waving Flag Theory

Post  aMAIZEing94 on Mon Aug 30, 2010 10:55 pm

In the FOX video, the point was to prove that the United States did not land on the moon. One piece of evidence used was to show that the American flag placed on the moon was "waving" when there should not be any air on the moon. The Mythbusters were able to further investigate the theory by doing an experiment to test a flag in a vaccumed air setting as it would be on the moon. The independent variable of the experiment was the air in the atmosphere. The dependent variable was the resulted motion of the flag (whether or not it waved). The constants of the experiment were the size of the flag and the height at which the flag is held. The detailed procedure would be as follows:
1) Obtain an official sized American flag (the size used by Neil Armstrong on his trip to the moon)
2) Set up one pole through the top of the flag (equal to its length) and another pole at a 90 degree angle along the side of the flag(atleast twice the flag's height) so that it will not collapse with its motions.
3) Attach the poles to a devise that will twist the flag as Neil Armstrong did while he was on the moon.
4) Place the flag in the vaccum air simulator at NASA Headquarters.
5) In a regular gravity setting, manuever and twist the flag using the device to test the flag's motions.
6) In a vaccumed air setting, manuever and twist the flag using the device to test the flag's motions.
The conclusion that the Mythbusters were able to draw was that in an air vaccumed setting, the flag created more of a waving motion and continued to move longer after being twisted. The conspiracy theorists were wrong in their thoughts that a flag should be motionless while on the moon where the air creates a vaccumed effect.

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Re: 3rd Hour Discussion Board #2 - MythBusters Bust the Moon Hoax

Post  Yofeetstink on Tue Aug 31, 2010 5:13 pm

Im going to talk about how the mythbusters proved that a flag can flap in a vacuum.

IV: Presence of Vacuum
DV: Whether or not flag will flap
Constants: Type of Flag, Size of Flag
Detailed Procedure: The MythBusters first placed a replica of the American flag planted on the moon into a vacuum chamber at the Marshall Space Flight Center. Then they tested at normal pressure and manipulated the flag. The momentum moved the flag around but the motion quickly dissipated. Then they did the same but with the presence of the vacuum. With the flag in the vacuum they started to manipulate it and it cause the flag to flap vigorously as if it were being blown by a breeze.
Conclusion: This busted the Myth and showed that a flag can flap in a vacuum and that NASA did not fake it.
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The Shady Truth

Post  Suga-Mama on Tue Aug 31, 2010 10:21 pm

Part of the moon hoax theory that the mythbusters tested was how brightly and clearly an astronaut would show up in a picture if he was standing in the shadows on the moon. The procedure for testing this myth was complicated. The mythbusters had to build a scale model of the lunar surface, moon lander, and astronaut. Along with the camerea they used to take the picture, these variables were the constants. They had to replicate the reflectivity of the moon's surface. They had to eliminate any possible variable that could cause light pollution of the testing set. And finally, the mythbusters had to find a light source that could closely represent the brightness of the sun. The mythbusters had to be as close to the real thing as possible to get the most accurate results. The IV of their experiment was the light source they used. The DV of the experiment was the quality of the picture. After setting up the experiment and taking the picture, the mythbusters concluded that it is absolutely possible to have a clear, good quality, picture even in the shadows on the moons surface. There is a sufficaiant amount of light reflecting off the moon's surface to take a good picture. Suspect
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HOAX or SHMOAX

Post  Flipper on Tue Aug 31, 2010 10:49 pm

The most convincing piece of "evidence" FOX had, to me, was the moving of the American Flag on the moon. After FOX pointed that out I was sure that we didn't land on the moon. Unfortunately, I didn't look at both sides of the story. Once, I saw the American flag wave in the air vacuum in the NASA facility, I knew that I was in the wrong.
IV: Atmospheric conditions ( Air or not)
DV: Moving of the Flag
2 Constant Variables: Amount of time flag was manipulated, Type of flag

-Construct or obtain an exact replica of the American flag used in the lunar landing.(Same size pole in length and width, same size flag, same texture, same weight)

-Gain acces to a powerful vacuum chamber that will leave no air surrounding your flag.

-Seal the flag in the vacuum chamber, but still be able to manipulate it in the same way Niel Armstrong did on the moon.

-For your control, manipulate the flag before the air vacuum is activated. ( Normal Atmospheric Pressure)

-Record your observations.

-Next, activate your vacuum chamber so that it matches the atmospheric conditons on the moon; manipulate the flag.

-Record your observations.

In conclusion, should have noticed that the American Flag should have potrayed a flag blowing in the wind, after it was manipulated after the vacuum was activated. Giving the FOX "Conspiracy Theory" a bad look.

2 sources of experimental error: Flag is the wrong size or the flag was manipulated for to long or short.

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moon landing

Post  penguin94 on Wed Sep 01, 2010 12:12 pm

If we do not look at both sides of an issue and attempt to prove something, then we may come across a point where someone else might have stronger conflicting evidence and our side would be crushed in a debate. Whereas if we research it and see points that the other side might question, we may come up with evidence to prove them wrong and strengthen our points. I believe that it is so easy to believe the things we see because we see things in our everyday lives and we have experienced that when we see something, 9/10 times it will be real. I believe that we DID land on the moon and the Mythbusters' tests help to confirm that. The test with the lit up astronaut in the picture really helped me to believe this. In it, they used moon like substances to create a reflective material that would have made the astronaut become lighter and it worked. Also, they went directly to NASA and tested with their equipment. These tests, such as the footprint one proved that we did go to the moon. The Vacuum in space does create a footprint on the moon.
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Moon Hoax is it really a hoax or not????

Post  violinist13 on Wed Sep 01, 2010 4:03 pm

The thing I found most interesting was how they proved that you can be in a shadow on the moon and still be seen. In the hoax theory people said that you would not be able to see the person in the picture. So the mythbusters made a model of a astronaut and a lunar limb. They also made a moon surface and put about the same of the reflectivity as a powder on there moon surface. Then they blacked out the set with only one light, a camera, and the model. Then they took a picture of the model and it turned out to be the same as the original photo. They IV is the reflectivity on the moon. The DV is the astronaut will be lit up. The constant variables are amount of set lights, dark room, and size of models. The mythbusters came to the conclusion that the myth was busted or proven wrong.
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Either we went to the moon or we didn't..

Post  tweetywizard on Wed Sep 01, 2010 4:16 pm

With the video we watched I honestly don't know weather to believe that we lander on the moon or not. But I will say that every sense i seen that video, it has proved that all the stuff from the Fox 2 News video can happen in space and just not on earth. So it is important to do our homework on both sides of an issue before taking a side beccausse if you just get one side you never know if what you are siding with is the whole truth or if it tells all the information needed and they are able to prove what they are saying not just guessing. It is so easy for people to believe what they see because we are taught that what the eyes see is real. And i think that what the eyes see the mind beleves, but what the eyes see is always deeper than what it seems. The danger of not researching a source to check the vlidity is that if you don't do that you could believe the source and then end up doing something or believing something you don't want to believe. After watching the videos i do not know what to believe. But the only people who know for sure if we went to the moon or not is Neil Armstrong, the ither men who went with him, and the rest of the NASA crew. So until next time, SEEYA!! flower

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sticking with my beliefs

Post  tw33tybirdn3rd on Wed Sep 01, 2010 8:41 pm

It is important to base your source on the facts of science. You look at both sides to a story so that you can see every aspect of the story. It is so that you can determine yourself what is true or not. I would say it is easy to believe things you see because it is what appear to your eyes it is what you believe to be true. The danger of research not being proven is a way to change all people aspect it would change the way people see things and it would have then see it in the wrong way so it is best to do your homework and do the research. In regards to the moon landing I still believe it is a scam by the government and NASA to prove them to be something they are not. I am stuck with the idea that they did fake everything and pulled everything off in a studio to say they did something they know they didn’t. Even after watching the Myth Busters I believe they got paid by the government to prove that they did land on the moon in any way they can so I’m sorry to say but people do get paid by the government to keep quite. I still believe that that flag was flying, that the ship was taken up by wires, and that it was in the studio because being out in space you would have to be able to see some stars. If we can see some here on Earth there is no possible way that you can’t see it from the moon which is much closer to stars than our planet. So yes I am still stuck with the fact that we did not land on the moon and it would have to take some very hard evidence and for me to be there to change my mind.

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Re: 3rd Hour Discussion Board #2 - MythBusters Bust the Moon Hoax

Post  Richiee12 on Wed Sep 01, 2010 8:52 pm

It is important for us to do our homework and look at both sides of an issue before taking a stance so that we can have background information on both sides of the story before making the judgment. One story can be plain myths and could be quite boring, another story could just be beefed up to make it seem as if its true. Eventually hopefully, the stories won't contradict each other, and they will have some part of the truth in both of them to help you believe which is true.
It is so easy for us to believe things we see, because we see it with our own eyes. When we see something with our eyes, our mind automatically tells us to believe it because it was seen. Not knowing whether the part was just acted, faked, or duplicated in some way our minds skip over that part and believes the main idea of what is being seen. As humans we think the only way to believe something, is to see it with our own eyes.
If you don't do research to ensure the validity of a source, then chances are you'll believe anything that has been said. Whether its true or not, you believe it. It's like a rumor, one person says one thing and all it takes is one person to believe for it to spread. Everyone believes it whether its true or not, no one has tried to investigate it. If you believe anything without doing research to ensure the validity of it, then chances are you've probably been lied to many times. You can't believe any and everything that you hear. It causes confusions, and can cause conflict.
In stance of the U.S. landing on the moon, I'm still convinced that we didn't land on the moon. The Landing on the Moon hoax video still seemed to be true. A flag doesn't wave that hard, if your just holding it up. It's not like the astronaut was waving it himself. The quiet space shuttle still isn't solved. No one seems to be able to explain how the space shuttle was silent, UNLESS the audio was silent. I'm still confused on that. Question It's just really not hard to believe that the landing of the moon was a hoax. The U.S. seems like the country that would stage this act just to be named the first to land on the moon.

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Re: 3rd Hour Discussion Board #2 - MythBusters Bust the Moon Hoax

Post  Richiee12 on Wed Sep 01, 2010 8:54 pm

penguin94 wrote: I believe that it is so easy to believe the things we see because we see things in our everyday lives and we have experienced that when we see something, 9/10 times it will be real.

I believe this. We're so accustomed to seeing things that's true, that we would really wouldn't know what to do if we saw something, and it later came back as being false. Our mind would be psyched.

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Re: 3rd Hour Discussion Board #2 - MythBusters Bust the Moon Hoax

Post  Richiee12 on Wed Sep 01, 2010 8:56 pm

violinist13 wrote:The thing I found most interesting was how they proved that you can be in a shadow on the moon and still be seen. In the hoax theory people said that you would not be able to see the person in the picture.

It would seem as if this wouldn't be true because it is so dark. Makes you wanna go try this on your own. Its like clearly being able to see someone in the dark. Night vision perhaps? Shocked

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MOON SAND IS ACTUALLY LIKE MOON SAND, OMK!!!!

Post  timmy buck buck on Wed Sep 01, 2010 9:12 pm

As a watcher of "MYTH BUSTERS" in Mrs.hancock's class i found the footprint left on the moon to be intriguing. They argued that if armstrong had really landed on the moon then you wouldnt be able to see armstrongs foot print in the " moon sand". It was said that since the moon has water then the foot print could not have been left behind due to the lack moisture in the moons soil making it seem as if it were rock hard. In this expirement the:
IV:whether the moon soil was moist enough to visibly show a footprint
DV:how visible the footprint shows up in the sand
Hypothesis:If the moon sand is moist enough then it the footprint will appear within the moon sand
2 Constants:type of moon sand used and the size of the astronaut boot
PRocEDURe:
1) the myth busters investigated sand from a beach which was moist, put a footprint in it and saw how well the imprint showed and compared it to that of the imprint left in the dry moon sand
2)they then compared the two footprints
3)next they put the foot print in the moon sand after they sealed it in a airtight seal
4)then they compared the twoo footprints
Conclusion: The myth was BUSTED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They found out that the footprint photographed by NASA was in fact possible on the moon. Due to the moons non existant air pressure and atmoshpere it was possible for the astronaut boot to leave a footprint within the sand, which was highly noticeable.
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MythBusters Bust The Moon Hoax: The Flag

Post  PaulyD on Wed Sep 01, 2010 10:10 pm

I'm going to talk about how the mythbusters disproved the consipracy about how the flag is flapping in the "breaze"
Iv: the vacuum
Dv: if the flag flaps or not
2 Constants: The Flag, The vacuum used to test the flag
Detailed Procedure:
1)Make a replica of the American flag used in the orginal moon landing
2) Set up one pole through the top of the flag so that it will not collapse with its motions.
3) Attach the poles to a devise that will twist the flag
4) Put the flag in the vaccum air simulator at NASA Headquarters.
5) In a regular gravity setting, move and twist the flag using the simulator to test the flag's motions.
6) In a vaccumed air setting,move and twist the flag using the simulator to test the flag's motions
Conclusion: The mythbusters are able to disprove the theory that the flag was faked and that the flag flapping could of been because the astornants had been moving the flag around when he placed in the ground.
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Pictures can change

Post  gamerdude94 on Wed Sep 01, 2010 11:01 pm

I liked the mythbusters video because they seemed to prove their evidence more than the fox video did when the fox video just seemed to point out things.The pieces of evidence that the mythbusters disproved that was most convincig to me was the pictures that related to the shadows of the rocks and he lighting of the astonaut. At first I was skeptical but then they proved the pictures could actually happen. For exaple they showed that the natural contours on the moon had an efect on the shadow views and made them look un parralel. The second photo was a controversy because the astronaut was lit up even though he was in the shadow of the moon lander. The mythbusters proved that the light reflection of the moon could light up the astronaut. The mythbusters used a scientific process for this video. For example lets say take a look at the effect of the moon surface on the shadows of the rock.

The IV would be the moon surface
The DV would be the shadows of the rock
Two constatnts would be the size of the model and the type of light

The procedure would be as follows:

1. Get a square table
2. Create a dust similar looking to the photo
3. Get scale models of everything in the photo (I.E. lunar module, rocks etc.)
4. Place everything according to photo.
5. Add ONE light source.
6. Try to add contours that moon would have naturally to see if any effect is placed on the shadows.

The conclusion would look like:
I conclude that if that surface of the moon is contoured under a single light source then the shadows of the rock will no longer be parrallel. Errors that could have occured was a changing in direction of light and over contouring of the model of the moon.

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Sooo we did land on the moon?

Post  Siillee-Differenter on Thu Sep 02, 2010 12:19 am

It is important to look at both sides of an issue so that you gain more understanding. You also gain more knowledge knowing what each issue is trying to explain and seeing their point of view. If you don't know the other side of the issue then when comparing and trying to make a difference you would not have much to use. It's also very common for us to believe everything that we see. This may be because we consider whats in front of us visually, nothing but real. Not enusring reasearch is quite a danger also for many reasons. For one you could be completely wrong about a fact you recieved from only using one source. Another reason could be the source that you used doesn't give you the complete information about the issue it pointed out and could leave out very important details.
Now that I have watched both videos regards to the moon landing, I think I'm back to believeing that we did land on the moon. After watching the first movie I automatically thought that us landing on the moon was not true, but once i watched the second video it gave me more explanation and proof on how we actually did land on the moon. Though I'm not completely sure about us landing on the moon I do believe theres a huge percent chance we did.

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In Response...

Post  Landis on Thu Sep 02, 2010 12:28 am

In response to the Mythbusters response to the conspiracy theorists video, I say...meh.

In my opinion, you can't take what either parties said at face value. As Ms.Hancock told us, both of these videos were made with an
agenda in mind, and you have to consider that agenda before understanding the truth in the matter. for example: The Mythbusters didn't actually disprove anything. All they proved is that nothing is 100%, in any way. There is still plenty of room for doubt.

Both of videos don't actually tell you enough to understand what is really going on. They can sound convincing and impressive, but that doesn't really mean anything. You have to do the research yourself in order to get a real grasp on it. The same goes for any news you might here in the media.

For example, with Obama. So many people just see something on the news and start forming opinions about it before really knowing what is going on. Whether it's negative or positive, they feed off of it. Both of these videos were pretty much just an extended form of propaganda. As long as you take the time to become knowledgeable on a subject, these type of mis-communications would not occur.

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Im confuzzled.

Post  calientelabios234 on Thu Sep 02, 2010 12:28 am

I guess I am just a easily persuaded person...which is not good. But I am torn between what to believe! First the mythbusters cannot create the exact setting of the moon...being in the earths atmosphere can make possible errpor to the experiments they conducted! I personally do not know what to believe because they busted almost every myth. But there are some things that they did not touch on like on the fox video it states before the astronauts were sent to the moon the lunar module was out of control here on Earth and yet it landed so gracefully on the moon! Also they did not talk about there being no stars in space when they were on the moon. So after watching both videos the Fox and Mythbuster, I still lean towards that we did not land on the moon. One thing that still baffles me is...if they got to the moon in 1969 when technology was not as advanced as us...how come over 40 years later we haven't been to the moon since? Selah. But it is very important to hear two sides of the story then decide what to believe because not all things are true. I learned that it is important to do your research yourself because then you can decide what to believe you tested it yourself. Going by what people say can mislead you to believe something false.
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Re: 3rd Hour Discussion Board #2 - MythBusters Bust the Moon Hoax

Post  Flipper on Thu Sep 02, 2010 2:01 pm

penguin94 wrote:If we do not look at both sides of an issue and attempt to prove something, then we may come across a point where someone else might have stronger conflicting evidence and our side would be crushed in a debate. Whereas if we research it and see points that the other side might question, we may come up with evidence to prove them wrong and strengthen our points. I believe that it is so easy to believe the things we see because we see things in our everyday lives and we have experienced that when we see something, 9/10 times it will be real.

I completely agree. The excitement of the possiblility that the lunar landing can easily sway your thoughts in the wrong direction. Before we started this discussion board topic i have always been a bit gullable. Now, I know that you must look at both sides of the story before choosing a side. I have also learned you must act off of facts and not emotions. You know? Twisted Evil

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Bad piece of evidence: You theorist could have done better than that!!!

Post  Flipper on Thu Sep 02, 2010 2:10 pm

timmy buck buck wrote:They argued that if armstrong had really landed on the moon then you wouldnt be able to see armstrongs foot print in the " moon sand". It was said that since the moon has water then the foot print could not have been left behind due to the lack moisture in the moons soil making it seem as if it were rock hard.

I never found that to be a good piece of evidence in the first place.
The conspiracy theorist have no idea what it is like to be on the moon and what the moon sand is like. In the mythbusters video that myth was easily busted once they used a sand that was almost identical to the sand on the moon.
To me, I think they just tried to make something up that sounded smart and used it for another piece of evidence. But in reality, when you look at all the variables it just wouldnt add up.

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Re: 3rd Hour Discussion Board #2 - MythBusters Bust the Moon Hoax

Post  krazedxasylum on Thu Sep 02, 2010 3:06 pm

The Effect Of a Vaccum on The shaking of a flag.

The independent variable in this experiment is the vaccum. The dependent variable is the shaking of the flag. The constants should be the size of the flag and the how long they shake the flag before letting it go. The details of the procedure are to make a vaccum, then to place a flag inside. After placing the flag, they shut the vaccum and used a special body suit to shake the flag. After shaking the flag, they let it go to see the reaction of the flag, whiched caued a rippling waving affect.

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Re: 3rd Hour Discussion Board #2 - MythBusters Bust the Moon Hoax

Post  aMAIZEing94 on Thu Sep 02, 2010 6:42 pm

tweetywizard wrote: So it is important to do our homework on both sides of an issue before taking a side beccausse if you just get one side you never know if what you are siding with is the whole truth or if it tells all the information needed and they are able to prove what they are saying not just guessing.

Tweetywizard, I totally agree with your statement. Sometimes we are persuaded into believing something without even seeing the evidence. It is nice that the Mythbusters did experiments to actually test their theories, instead of just telling us to believe something. The conspiracy theorists on the FOX Video just told us their opinions. Their "evidence" and false accusations could have easily been faked... but then again... so could the Mythbusters'... confused

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Re: 3rd Hour Discussion Board #2 - MythBusters Bust the Moon Hoax

Post  aMAIZEing94 on Thu Sep 02, 2010 6:49 pm

calientelabios234 wrote: I guess I am just a easily persuaded person...which is not good. But I am torn between what to believe! First the mythbusters cannot create the exact setting of the moon...being in the earths atmosphere can make possible errpor to the experiments they conducted! I personally do not know what to believe because they busted almost every myth. But there are some things that they did not touch on like on the fox video it states before the astronauts were sent to the moon the lunar module was out of control here on Earth and yet it landed so gracefully on the moon!

I am also easily persuaded and you bring up some good points. Conducting an experiment to test something that was done on the moon should definitely not have the same results on Earth. It is also convenient how most of the myths shown were either busted or just questionable and the rest were not even discussed. It makes you wonder! Wink

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Re: 3rd Hour Discussion Board #2 - MythBusters Bust the Moon Hoax

Post  iluvowls on Thu Sep 02, 2010 10:44 pm

Suga-Mama wrote:Part of the moon hoax theory that the mythbusters tested was how brightly and clearly an astronaut would show up in a picture if he was standing in the shadows on the moon. The procedure for testing this myth was complicated. The mythbusters had to build a scale model of the lunar surface, moon lander, and astronaut. Along with the camerea they used to take the picture, these variables were the constants. They had to replicate the reflectivity of the moon's surface. They had to eliminate any possible variable that could cause light pollution of the testing set. And finally, the mythbusters had to find a light source that could closely represent the brightness of the sun. The mythbusters had to be as close to the real thing as possible to get the most accurate results. The IV of their experiment was the light source they used. The DV of the experiment was the quality of the picture. After setting up the experiment and taking the picture, the mythbusters concluded that it is absolutely possible to have a clear, good quality, picture even in the shadows on the moons surface. There is a sufficaiant amount of light reflecting off the moon's surface to take a good picture. Suspect



I totally agree with what you said about the lighting. I also think that the fact that the astronaut's suit was pure white was a reason why it was visible under the dark shadow. I think it was completely ridiculous for the people on Conspiracy Theory to try to say that the astronaut would not be visible. I was not surprised when the Myth Busters busted this theory. It seemed to me that the people on Conspiracy Theory were looking for things they they could say weren't possible in the moon landing.

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Re: 3rd Hour Discussion Board #2 - MythBusters Bust the Moon Hoax

Post  penguin94 on Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:09 pm

[quote="timmy buck buck"] As a watcher of "MYTH BUSTERS" in Mrs.hancock's class i found the footprint left on the moon to be intriguing. They argued that if armstrong had really landed on the moon then you wouldnt be able to see armstrongs foot print in the " moon sand". It was said that since the moon has water then the foot print could not have been left behind due to the lack moisture in the moons soil making it seem as if it were rock hard.

I agree, this experiment made me want to go out and try it. It also makes me wonder if other things are affected by the vacuum like their space suits. Would it have been harder to move in a vacuum while wearing it? When i think of something in a vacuum, i picture something being squeezed or tightened. It is an interesting concept. Smile
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Re: 3rd Hour Discussion Board #2 - MythBusters Bust the Moon Hoax

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